Hansard excerpts-Question period- Oct.19,2005

Justice
Hon. Stephen Harper (Leader of the Opposition, CPC): Mr. Speaker, yesterday the Deputy Prime Minister was asked about convicted criminals getting passes to children's theme parks. She told the House she did not know whether this was happening. Yet a Correctional Service Canada official says it happens all the time. In fact, the York region police chief says that hard core criminals on no less than nine occasions got travel permits to Wonderland this summer.

How can the minister not have a clue that this sort of thing is going on in her own department?

Hon. Anne McLellan (Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, as I indicated yesterday, the allegations made by the chief of police were not known to me. I asked Correctional Service Canada to follow up on this, and it is investigating the matter.

Temporary releases are provided from facilities such as halfway houses. They always are provided on conditions. I have asked Correctional Service Canada to follow up on the specific allegation that the chief has made. However, I also call upon the chief and would ask the chief to provide me with any specific information or facts he has.

Hon. Stephen Harper (Leader of the Opposition, CPC): Mr. Speaker, the minister's job is to know that this happens and to ensure that it never happens in the first place.

The president of the Ontario police chiefs said, “Conditional and intermittent sentences, house arrest, 2 for 1 and 3 for 1 earned sentence protocols, mandatory parole and weekend passes to local theme parks do little to dissuade murderers, marijuana grow operators, ecstasy manufacturers, carjackers, child molesters and others from committing these horrific crimes”.

Everyone else in the country knows being soft of crime does not work. When is the minister and the government going to get it?

¸ (1425)

Hon. Anne McLellan (Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, as I made plain yesterday, the purpose of our corrections system and our parole system, the transcendent and fundamental objective of that system, is public safety. I also have suggested that it is time for us to review both our Corrections and Conditional Release Act and our parole legislation. That is why I have referred both to the Standing Committee on Justice.

If the opposition does not have any views on that and want to leave it up to us to look at the reform of those legislations, then we will do that. However, in the name of democracy--

The Speaker: The hon. Leader of the Opposition.

Hon. Stephen Harper (Leader of the Opposition, CPC): Mr. Speaker, the Deputy Prime Minister started both these answers with this cute little smirk. When I take my family to Wonderland and other families, there is nothing funny about it.

The Vancouver Board of Trade has said that crime is so bad in Vancouver that it is doing damage—

Some hon. members: Oh, oh!

The Speaker: Order, please. We need to have a little order. The Deputy Prime Minister I know is waiting to hear the next question. I cannot hear it. I do not know how she can and she is sitting right across from the Leader of the Opposition. We will have to have a little order, please. The Leader of the Opposition has the floor.

Hon. Stephen Harper: Mr. Speaker, talk about a bunch of people who just do not get it. Yesterday the Vancouver Board of Trade said that crime is so bad in Vancouver it is doing damage to the economy of the city. Vancouver Police Chief Graham says federal laws allow thieves to reoffend and they get bail again and again and again.

When is the government, after 12 years—

The Speaker: The hon. Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada.

Hon. Irwin Cotler (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, the opposition does not take note of the fact that we have some of the most stringent penalties in the world right now. We have given notice both with regard to the reform of the conditional sentencing regime and with respect to the inquiry now with regard to bail review reform under the federal-provincial-territorial conference.

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Correctional Service Canada
Mr. Peter MacKay (Central Nova, CPC): Mr. Speaker, shockingly the Liberal government is allowing prisoners to use the Access to Information Act to obtain information about prison security systems and the personal details of the guards.

Recently, a partial list of Correctional Service employees in Quebec was released to a prisoner and one guard was distraught to learn that a prisoner was attempting to get her name, rank, qualifications and where she previously worked. Guards have a legitimate concern, in particular, that prisoners may gain access to their addresses.

Why is the government making it easier for prisoners to get sensitive information about the guards that could endanger these officers and the Canadian public?

Hon. Anne McLellan (Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, to the best of my knowledge, none of that sensitive information is available to any prison inmate within the federal correction system.

Mr. Peter MacKay (Central Nova, CPC): Mr. Speaker, the minister is sadly uninformed about her own department. Is it any wonder why Canadians are starting to think that the inmates are running the penitentiaries?

Let us look at some of the access requests that were disclosed by her department: information on the inmate phone call monitoring system; information on drug scanners and the results of these scans; and all procedures and policies related to the use of drug scanners and drug dogs checking visitors. This information could cost correctional officers their lives, and it is certainly useful for escapes.

Could the minister just explain why this information about security systems is being given to inmates? What is next, picks and shovels?

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Hon. Anne McLellan (Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Public Safety and Emergency Preparedness, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, I reiterate again that to the best of my—

Some hon. members: Oh, oh!

The Speaker: Order, please. Everyone is doing the best he or she can. The trouble is we have to be able to hear the best and with all this noise we cannot hear it, so we have to have some order while the Deputy Prime Minister gives her answer to the question asked by the member for Central Nova.

Hon. Anne McLellan: Mr. Speaker, to the best of my knowledge this information has not been released under access to information laws. In fact, any information that would relate directly to the security of either physical prison facilities or information in relation to the safety and security surrounding prison guards is specifically exempted from access to information laws.

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Organized Crime
Mr. Vic Toews (Provencher, CPC): Mr. Speaker, yesterday the Ontario police chief told Canadians that lax Liberal laws were strangling and obstructing their efforts to fight crime. International organized crime is using Canada as a base of operations because drug dealers here are sentenced to house arrest instead of real prison sentences.

Why does the Minister of Justice continue to support house arrest when drug dealers are out on the streets killing our children?

Hon. Irwin Cotler (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, that is yet another misrepresentation by the hon. member of the opposition.

With respect to the question of house arrest, we have said that with regard to all serious offences we will be introducing legislation that will put an end to conditional sentencing in those matters.

Mr. Vic Toews (Provencher, CPC): Mr. Speaker, the minister does not know his facts about house arrest for drug dealers. They are getting it.

Liberal patronage appointee, Senator Larry Campbell, says that concern about the spread of crystal meth is garbage. Teachers and nurses are telling us the spread is real. The RCMP now tells us that Canada ranks second as a source of crystal meth seized in Japan.

Is the justice minister aware of the concerns of teachers, nurses and police about the spread of crystal meth or are their concerns just garbage? What does he say?

Hon. Irwin Cotler (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, my response, if the hon. member wishes to take it seriously, is that we have taken initiatives. We took them already this summer. We are not engaged in fearmongering. We are engaged in law enforcement.
Organized Crime
Mrs. Nina Grewal (Fleetwood—Port Kells, CPC): Mr. Speaker, Liberal patronage hack, Larry Campbell, recently said, “Crystal meth is no big deal”.

Someone should tell Mr. Campbell about the reports that one in ten Surrey youth have tried crystal meth and about the major crystal meth lab busts in Richmond.

Why do the Liberals insist on a do nothing approach that has led to increased drug abuse, an explosion in grow ops and wrecked lives? When will the Liberal government take crystal meth seriously and impose mandatory prison sentences for peddling crystal meth?

Hon. Irwin Cotler (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, we take crystal meth seriously and that is the reason that we took the initiatives we did this summer in that regard with my colleague, the health minister.

As well, we have a specific pro-prosecutorial policy with regard to all drug prosecutions at this point with regard to community impact statements, with regard to submissions on the gravity of the offence and with regard to the entire approach to allow the courts to appreciate the gravity of the offence and the responsibility of the offender.

Mr. Russ Hiebert (South Surrey—White Rock—Cloverdale, CPC): Mr. Speaker, for weeks now I have been holding meetings across Canada as co-chair of our party's task force on safe streets and healthy communities. I have heard from police officers, youth workers and city councillors about the exploding problem of crystal meth abuse.

The spokesman for the Liberal MP for Richmond says that our concern about crystal meth is “irresponsible fearmongering” and yet three big meth labs were just shut down in his riding.

The first step to solving an addiction is to admit that one has a problem. Will the Prime Minister stand up and admit that the Liberal MP for Richmond is out of touch and that crystal meth is a scourge on our Canadian cities?

Hon. Irwin Cotler (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, as a government, we have said unequivocally that crystal meth is a serious problem. We have articulated it as a policy and we have acted in that regard.

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Justice
Mr. Daryl Kramp (Prince Edward—Hastings, CPC): Mr. Speaker, at the justice committee yesterday we heard senior police officials from across Canada pleading with the government to wake up to the realities that they are facing; the reality that innocent people are being shot, gangs and thugs are ruling the streets, witnesses are afraid to testify, drugs are rampant, parole and bail is just a revolving door these days and repeat offenders are commonplace.

When will the Minister of Justice listen to the police, listen to the victims and listen to Canadians and support the additional mandatory sentences that which the police are calling for?

Hon. Irwin Cotler (Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada, Lib.): Mr. Speaker, I have met with representative police associations and with families of crime victims. I went across the country this past summer and said that we were open to any initiative with respect to combating crime in the matter of mandatory minimums.

I have no aversion to mandatory minimums, neither personally nor professionally. I only look at the evidence and the evidence has demonstrated that such mandatory minimums are neither effective nor are they a deterrent.

We are still prepared to look at any initiatives that may assist in that regard.